Does this rhythm have a name?

[Chris Whealy]

I've heard several drummers play this rhythm, and the one I'm listening
to now is Stanton Moore. On his album All Kooked Out, the track is
called Nalgas.

Stanton throws in little fills and the end each 8 beat pattern, but its
basically like this (hat starts only on quarter notes but changes to
eigths after a couple of bars):

1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5 & 6 & 7 & 8 &
HiHat x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
Snare x x x x
Kick x x x x

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[Pete Pemberton]

"Chris Whealy" <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> wrote in message
news:bhvoka$m76$1@news1.wdf.sap-ag.de...
> I've heard several drummers play this rhythm, and the one I'm listening
> to now is Stanton Moore. On his album All Kooked Out, the track is
> called Nalgas.
>
> Stanton throws in little fills and the end each 8 beat pattern, but its
> basically like this (hat starts only on quarter notes but changes to
> eigths after a couple of bars):
>
> 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5 & 6 & 7 & 8 &
> HiHat x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
> Snare x x x x
> Kick x x x x
>
> Chris


Chris just tell us where the hits are. There is no need to make a map. It
doesn't work, anyway. I can't tell if the bass drum is on the downbeats or
not, likewise with snare.

[Jay Epstein]

Chris,
This is a slight variation on what I've always heard as the James
Brown (Jabbo or Clyde) 'Cold Sweat' groove: http://tinyurl.com/klyb

Jay

Chris Whealy <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> wrote:
>I've heard several drummers play this rhythm, and the one I'm listening
>to now is Stanton Moore. On his album All Kooked Out, the track is
>called Nalgas.
>Stanton throws in little fills and the end each 8 beat pattern, but its
>basically like this (hat starts only on quarter notes but changes to
>eigths after a couple of bars):
>
> 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5 & 6 & 7 & 8 &
>HiHat x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
>Snare x x x x
>Kick x x x x
>
>Chris

[Chris Whealy]

> Chris just tell us where the hits are. There is no need to make a map. It
> doesn't work, anyway. I can't tell if the bass drum is on the downbeats or
> not, likewise with snare.
>

Pete, your news reader must be displaying the text using a proportional
spacing typeface. Either cut and paste the text into notepad or change
your display typeface to something like Courier. Either way you should
see the correct alignment.

If your news readers formats as HTML, then this should work.

<pre>
1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5 & 6 & 7 & 8 &
HiHat x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x
Snare x x x x
Kick x x x x
</pre>

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[Chris Whealy]

> This is a slight variation on what I've always heard as the James
> Brown (Jabbo or Clyde) 'Cold Sweat' groove: http://tinyurl.com/klyb
>

Thanks for that Jay, but unfortunately I can't access that URL. Some
sort of DNS problem. Does the file exist anywhere else?

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[Jay Epstein]

Chris you may have to cut & paste:
http://mfile.akamai.com/6555/rm/muze.download.akamai.com/2890/us/usrm/767/212767_1_14.ram?obj=v10609

Jay

Chris Whealy <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> wrote:
>> This is a slight variation on what I've always heard as the James
>> Brown (Jabbo or Clyde) 'Cold Sweat' groove: http://tinyurl.com/klyb
>>
>Thanks for that Jay, but unfortunately I can't access that URL. Some
>sort of DNS problem. Does the file exist anywhere else?
>
>Chris

[Chris Whealy]

> http://mfile.akamai.com/6555/rm/muze.download.akamai.com/2890/us/usrm/767/212767_1_14.ram?obj=v10609
>
> Jay
>

Thanks, but still no luck. I keep getting the error message that the
server has no DNS name.

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[Jay Epstein]

Chris,
I searched Barnes & Noble for 'Cold Sweat' & it gave me this tidbit:
http://music.barnesandnoble.com/search/product.asp?userid=4XUK7YJCHE&ean=731453116528
Which includes a short rehearsal cut of JB (cut # 14) on which you can
hear the groove well.
Jay

Chris Whealy <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> wrote:
Jay wrote:
>> http://mfile.akamai.com/6555/rm/muze.download.akamai.com/2890/us/usrm/767/212767_1_14.ram?obj=v10609

>Thanks, but still no luck. I keep getting the error message that the
>server has no DNS name.

[Chris Whealy]

Jay Epstein wrote:
> Chris,
> I searched Barnes & Noble for 'Cold Sweat' & it gave me this tidbit:
> http://music.barnesandnoble.com/search/product.asp?userid=4XUK7YJCHE&ean=731453116528
> Which includes a short rehearsal cut of JB (cut # 14) on which you can
> hear the groove well.
> Jay
>

Got it! Thanks!

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[Chris Whealy]

Thanks to Jay's posts (and much arguing with Real Player config),
Stanton Moore is reusing the groove from James Brown's track "Cold
Sweat" on the track "Nalgas" on the album "All Kooked Out".

Since I'm after a name for this particular rhythm, and the JB track
seems to be an early published reference, I'll call it the "Cold Sweat
Groove".

Not particularly imaginitive, I know, but it serves the purpose.

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--

[David Crigger]

in article bi4icn$j0t$4@news1.wdf.sap-ag.de, Chris Whealy at
chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com wrote on 8/22/03 12:57 AM:

> Thanks to Jay's posts (and much arguing with Real Player config),
> Stanton Moore is reusing the groove from James Brown's track "Cold
> Sweat" on the track "Nalgas" on the album "All Kooked Out".
>
> Since I'm after a name for this particular rhythm, and the JB track
> seems to be an early published reference, I'll call it the "Cold Sweat
> Groove".
>
> Not particularly imaginitive, I know, but it serves the purpose.
>
> Chris


I vaguely remember this being called "fatback" - but I could be totally
wrong.

DC

[Michael Welzl]

Hi,

I remember hearing this groove in a "cold sweat" context a long
time ago (by context, I mean: in this song, and also played by bands
emulating the style of old funk tunes).

Later I got into New Orleans drumming. Turns out that N.O.
drummers use this groove (alterations of it, and sometimes with
a more shufled feel to it) a lot. Check out anything with Russell
Batiste for example, or Jeffrey Alexander who plays with
Jon Cleary. Or John Vidacovich; all the funky New Orleans
drummers seem to do this beat shifting thing a lot. To me, it's
a key beat-turning-groove, and you can do much with it ...
actually, I remember Stanton Moore playing stuff like that on
Galactic CDs I own (I think one is called "all cooked out").
I believe that one can learn a lot from listening to Stanton Moore -
in terms of figuring out how to make this work and shift the
groove a little without necessarily making it as exposed as
it is in "cold sweat". You end up spicing your grooves a little
in the N.O. way without getting in anybody's way.

BTW, it also turns out that the original "cold sweat" drummer,
Clyde Stubblefield, is from New Orleans :) interesting, isn't it?
So, it's in fact probably rather the "Standard New Orleans Beat
Shifter" than the "Cold Sweat" groove (although calling it after the
popular song sure makes sense).

Cheers,
Michael

"Chris Whealy" <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:bi4icn$j0t$4@news1.wdf.sap-ag.de...
> Thanks to Jay's posts (and much arguing with Real Player config),
> Stanton Moore is reusing the groove from James Brown's track "Cold
> Sweat" on the track "Nalgas" on the album "All Kooked Out".
>
> Since I'm after a name for this particular rhythm, and the JB track
> seems to be an early published reference, I'll call it the "Cold Sweat
> Groove".
>
> Not particularly imaginitive, I know, but it serves the purpose.
>
> Chris
>
> --
> The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
> but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
> --
>

[Michael Welzl]

Hi again,

sorry - the name of the Galactic CD was "crazyhorse moongoose"
(all cooked out is stanton moore's cd). btw, did you see this?
http://fogworld.com/watch/

you can see him play there, it's great

cheers,
michael


"Michael Welzl" <michael.welzl@chello.at> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:yXL1b.38198$gX4.403727@news.chello.at...
> Hi,
>
> I remember hearing this groove in a "cold sweat" context a long
> time ago (by context, I mean: in this song, and also played by bands
> emulating the style of old funk tunes).
>
> Later I got into New Orleans drumming. Turns out that N.O.
> drummers use this groove (alterations of it, and sometimes with
> a more shufled feel to it) a lot. Check out anything with Russell
> Batiste for example, or Jeffrey Alexander who plays with
> Jon Cleary. Or John Vidacovich; all the funky New Orleans
> drummers seem to do this beat shifting thing a lot. To me, it's
> a key beat-turning-groove, and you can do much with it ...
> actually, I remember Stanton Moore playing stuff like that on
> Galactic CDs I own (I think one is called "all cooked out").
> I believe that one can learn a lot from listening to Stanton Moore -
> in terms of figuring out how to make this work and shift the
> groove a little without necessarily making it as exposed as
> it is in "cold sweat". You end up spicing your grooves a little
> in the N.O. way without getting in anybody's way.
>
> BTW, it also turns out that the original "cold sweat" drummer,
> Clyde Stubblefield, is from New Orleans :) interesting, isn't it?
> So, it's in fact probably rather the "Standard New Orleans Beat
> Shifter" than the "Cold Sweat" groove (although calling it after the
> popular song sure makes sense).
>
> Cheers,
> Michael
>
> "Chris Whealy" <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:bi4icn$j0t$4@news1.wdf.sap-ag.de...
> > Thanks to Jay's posts (and much arguing with Real Player config),
> > Stanton Moore is reusing the groove from James Brown's track "Cold
> > Sweat" on the track "Nalgas" on the album "All Kooked Out".
> >
> > Since I'm after a name for this particular rhythm, and the JB track
> > seems to be an early published reference, I'll call it the "Cold Sweat
> > Groove".
> >
> > Not particularly imaginitive, I know, but it serves the purpose.
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > --
> > The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
> > but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
> > --
> >
>
>

[DrumSac]

I went back and listened to the track in question after seeing this
thread. The main groove of the tune is a variation of "Cold Sweat,"
but it's also worth mentioning that the intro groove right at the top
(with quarter notes on the hi-hat) sounds a bit like "Workin' In A
Coal Mine" by Lee Dorsey. When I lived down in New Orleans I saw a
Johnny Vidacovich clinic in which he cited that tune as a prime
example of the way that New Orleans drummers apply the "second line"
rhythm to rock and roll.

I agree with Michael's comments below. For New Orleans drummers,
shifting the backbeat around is standard operating procedure. They
all do it - Russell, Jellybean, Zigaboo, Stanton, Kevin O'Day, Johnny
V., Willie Green, Jason Marsalis, etc.

By the way - there used to be a 12" vinyl EP of outtakes from the "All
Kooked Out" sessions that was sold only at Garage A Trois shows (so I
was told). It contained four improvised jams recorded late at night
after Stanton, Skerik and Charlie Hunter had been fishing out on the
bayou or something. If you dig Stanton, it's worth digging around for
this. I remember there being some unbelievable drum 'n' bass inspired
playing from him, as well as his usual funk bag.

-Sac

"Michael Welzl" <michael.welzl@chello.at> wrote in message news:<yXL1b.38198$gX4.403727@news.chello.at>...
> Hi,
>
> I remember hearing this groove in a "cold sweat" context a long
> time ago (by context, I mean: in this song, and also played by bands
> emulating the style of old funk tunes).
>
> Later I got into New Orleans drumming. Turns out that N.O.
> drummers use this groove (alterations of it, and sometimes with
> a more shufled feel to it) a lot. Check out anything with Russell
> Batiste for example, or Jeffrey Alexander who plays with
> Jon Cleary. Or John Vidacovich; all the funky New Orleans
> drummers seem to do this beat shifting thing a lot. To me, it's
> a key beat-turning-groove, and you can do much with it ...
> actually, I remember Stanton Moore playing stuff like that on
> Galactic CDs I own (I think one is called "all cooked out").
> I believe that one can learn a lot from listening to Stanton Moore -
> in terms of figuring out how to make this work and shift the
> groove a little without necessarily making it as exposed as
> it is in "cold sweat". You end up spicing your grooves a little
> in the N.O. way without getting in anybody's way.
>
> BTW, it also turns out that the original "cold sweat" drummer,
> Clyde Stubblefield, is from New Orleans :) interesting, isn't it?
> So, it's in fact probably rather the "Standard New Orleans Beat
> Shifter" than the "Cold Sweat" groove (although calling it after the
> popular song sure makes sense).
>
> Cheers,
> Michael
>
> "Chris Whealy" <chris.whealy.NOSPAM@sap.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:bi4icn$j0t$4@news1.wdf.sap-ag.de...
> > Thanks to Jay's posts (and much arguing with Real Player config),
> > Stanton Moore is reusing the groove from James Brown's track "Cold
> > Sweat" on the track "Nalgas" on the album "All Kooked Out".
> >
> > Since I'm after a name for this particular rhythm, and the JB track
> > seems to be an early published reference, I'll call it the "Cold Sweat
> > Groove".
> >
> > Not particularly imaginitive, I know, but it serves the purpose.
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > --
> > The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
> > but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
> > --
> >

[Chris Whealy]

Great, thanks for the info.

Chris

--
The voice of ignorance speaks loud and long,
but the words of the wise are quiet and few.
--